Humane Treatment of Fish

[Sylvia Bernstein]

Every so often when I talk about aquaponics someone brings up issues around either the captive culture, or humane slaughter of fish.  These are important, relevant questions that we are going to need to wrestle with in aquaponics.

 

Here is a link to a short PETA editorial that just came out in our local paper about this subject.  Treehugger.com regularly brings this up.

How do you answer these questions?  Are fish humanely treated in aquaponics?  How do you humanely slaughter a fish?

[Todd Sowell]

Go Jon and Rupert!!   I agree!  Sorry she didn't have time for you Kellen

 

I like the other PETA--People Eating Tasty Animals

[RupertofOZ]

Don't misread me Todd... Gina expresses a valid concern for the rights and need for respect for all living things...

 

And I always give blessing to anything that I eat... and/or that sustains me...

 

And that encompasses the whole circle of life on this planet.. and the planet itself... of which I am but an insignificant part...

[Rob Nash]

...i like to whack em, then throw them in the ice bath.

 

[Todd Sowell]

Not at all Rupert. I like Joel Salitin's position of "celebrating the pigness of the pig"

If I'm going to eat it I'm going to take good care of it and give it the best life I can while it's here

[Carey Ma]

Here, here! I second your position Todd.

Respect! That's is all it comes down to.

[Gina Cavaliero]

@ Rupert -  thank you for your acknowledgement, yes it is entirely the human's fault.  

@Jon - vegan terrorism!  LMAO!  That's hilarious.  Sorry, but I still think you choose a very poor comparison with the Taliban and if you are only agenda was just to stir sh*& up, well I guess you did.  Most activists take extremes.  That's kind of how activism works Jon, like it or not.   And thanks for pointing out that this is a forum for aquapons, again!   I thought this was a forum for peanut farmers.  

I agree that everyone has the right to eat what ever it is they like and believe me this is not my first round of debate of vegan or vegitarianism vs being an omnivore.   I love that the meat eaters want to grunt and get so fired up over their right to eat meat!  I have thumbs and can make fire, grunt, grunt, meat!  Fine, raise a cow, go hunt.  But they don't and the vast majority eat meat without the slightest conscious thought of how that steak got to their plate or that hamburger to their mouth.  That's the problem and the industry that is more concerned with profits over animal welfare relies on that.  
 

But the farm calls now and I must get to the market to sell my peanuts...

[Vlad Jovanovic]

Over the last year or so, this has been a most interesting thread to follow (albeit a bit more entertaining in the last few days). And can sort of relate to ‘both camps’.

 During the last almost decade of my life in the U.S. I was mostly a vegetarian, the exception was when I was in the position to catch, trap or kill my own meat (which was not often enough). I did not have an aversion to meat based solely on moral grounds, nor nutritional ones (crappy grain fed meat) etc… I have to agree with the overwhelming science that all seems to point to the direction of our omnivorous past and nature…As much as I would like to bask in the Neo-Romantic, Victorian notion of a matriarchal berry-gathering-vegetarian-at peace with everything, human past…I think that is just fantasy. And believed so even while (mostly) abstaining from eating meat.

The reason I (mostly) did not eat meat was that I found it degrading and disrespectful to both the animal and to myself to waltz into a supermarket and be able to purchase a colorful, wrapped up pre-made package of flesh. Just like buying a pack of cigarettes or any other ‘product’.  I think it’s seriously un-healthy psychologically, for society as a whole, to be so damn far removed from ones food source. And that such an utter lack of respect/awareness probably helps lead to many, many other problems…Some of which spawn the existence of groups like PETA. I don’t have a problem with their extremism (actually if they really believe it, then they are not nearly extreme enough), nor their acts of ‘terrorism’, because like the Taliban they believe they are right. This too is human. From their perspective of moral high ground, society is the terrorist. (Which there is a case for). I do however have a problem with the fact that they quite often seem like a bunch of hypocritical twats. Or are just plain silly. They really need to better develop their military arm of the animal liberation/rights operations IMO if they are serious.

The fact is that it takes death to sustain life. Period. I believe that all living things have some type of consciousness, plants included. And will give thanks equally to the lettuce I harvest or the animal that I kill so that I may live. Just because I can relate to the animal more, (eyes, ears, shape) doesn’t mean the plant is less worthy (well nutritionally maybe). That would be like choosing a humans worth based his/her ability to speak your particular language…

Back to the topic at hand…As far as ‘humane’ killing, I think learning to do it quickly and completely is the best we can hope for, as well as the most respectful.

But seriously, do you really need that much fickin' meat? I mean, I lead a relatively active lifestyle (for a "modern" homo-sapien) and get by for weeks or months just fine without it? To put it in short strokes., a lot of westerners wake up, get in a car/bus, take the elevator up, then sit at their desk all day, take the elevator back down, back to the car etc...I mean not exactly the most justifiable use of all those proteins IMO? And the reallity is, to a large extent, those are the type of humans that meat industry exists for...in all it's PETA 'mass-murdering' cruel-grain-feeding-water usurping-cardiac arresting-pre-packaged glory...

[Sylvia Bernstein]

Wow.  Well said, Vlad. 

[Sahib Punjabi]

Nice :-)

Really enjoyed your response. Excellent questions.

God bless

Vlad Jovanovic said:

Over the last year or so, this has been a most interesting thread to follow (albeit a bit more entertaining in the last few days). And can sort of relate to ‘both camps’.

 During the last almost decade of my life in the U.S. I was mostly a vegetarian, the exception was when I was in the position to catch, trap or kill my own meat (which was not often enough). I did not have an aversion to meat based solely on moral grounds, nor nutritional ones (crappy grain fed meat) etc… I have to agree with the overwhelming science that all seems to point to the direction of our omnivorous past and nature…As much as I would like to bask in the Neo-Romantic, Victorian notion of a matriarchal berry-gathering-vegetarian-at peace with everything, human past…I think that is just fantasy. And believed so even while (mostly) abstaining from eating meat.

The reason I (mostly) did not eat meat was that I found it degrading and disrespectful to both the animal and to myself to waltz into a supermarket and be able to purchase a colorful, wrapped up pre-made package of flesh. Just like buying a pack of cigarettes or any other ‘product’.  I think it’s seriously un-healthy psychologically, for society as a whole, to be so damn far removed from ones food source. And that such an utter lack of respect/awareness probably helps lead to many, many other problems…Some of which spawn the existence of groups like PETA. I don’t have a problem with their extremism (actually if they really believe it, then they are not nearly extreme enough), nor their acts of ‘terrorism’, because like the Taliban they believe they are right. This too is human. From their perspective of moral high ground, society is the terrorist. (Which there is a case for). I do however have a problem with the fact that they quite often seem like a bunch of hypocritical twats. Or are just plain silly. They really need to better develop their military arm of the animal liberation/rights operations IMO if they are serious.

The fact is that it takes death to sustain life. Period. I believe that all living things have some type of consciousness, plants included. And will give thanks equally to the lettuce I harvest or the animal that I kill so that I may live. Just because I can relate to the animal more, (eyes, ears, shape) doesn’t mean the plant is less worthy (well nutritionally maybe). That would be like choosing a humans worth based his/her ability to speak your particular language…

Back to the topic at hand…As far as ‘humane’ killing, I think learning to do it quickly and completely is the best we can hope for, as well as the most respectful.

But seriously, do you really need that much fickin' meat? I mean, I lead a relatively active lifestyle (for a "modern" homo-sapien) and get by for weeks or months just fine without it? To put it in short strokes., a lot of westerners wake up, get in a car/bus, take the elevator up, then sit at their desk all day, take the elevator back down, back to the car etc...I mean not exactly the most justifiable use of all those proteins IMO? And the reallity is, to a large extent, those are the type of humans that meat industry exists for...in all it's PETA 'mass-murdering' cruel-grain-feeding-water usurping-cardiac arresting-pre-packaged glory...

[Carey Ma]

I love reading your stuff Vlad. We seem to be on very similar wavelengths but you are a lot more concise and organized than my scattered mind.

Write on brother!

[adam harwood]

Hello, we use ice water it is the far far away the kindest way to , we also bless and pray in thanks,

also we only take 40 fish a day to ensure the fish are packaged quickly and placed in 20 bellow zero, only  2 fillets in a bone proof bag 6 mil , we have a hinkleman cyro-vac, that is top of the line, it ensures a professional seal , we also have certified  journey man butcher,  the fish must be superior in all respects to be of real value, nile hybrid from americulture, # 1 in the usa