chloramine

[Mark]

Hi All

Brand new to AP and to this site, this site is chock full of info, thank you!

I put my system together yesterday 40 gallon tub for the fish tank and 25 gallon tub for the grow bed, using Affnan's bell siphon(the siphon worked first time no problems, thank you Affnan)

I find out today that my water has chloramine in it, so how to get rid of it?

I have read some about Vitamin C and that it might be able to remove it?

Since I have not added any grow media yet, what would be the downside to trying the Vitamin C method.

If the Vitamin C removes it, will the Vitamin C at some point dissipate from the water so not to affect bacteria growth?

If not the Vitamin C method, would using bottled water be an option?

Any recommendations on a test kit for chlorine?

Mark

[Mark]

I wanted to thank you both for your help.

I bought some this afternoon at a health food store, it list the only other ingredient as calcium, not sure if this will hurt anything but I broke apart 1 capsule and added it to the water. 

I tested before I added it with a test strip kit which said it would test for chloramine ,PH, water hardness, nitrites and nitrates.

The square for chloramine was yellowish so it seemed to work although I have heard the accuracy of test strips is not that good.

After adding the one capsule contents I let the water cycle some and did another test, this one seemed about the same color, maybe a little less.

I then added another capsules content and let the water cycle some more and then tested again, this time the square was white, so it looks like it worked :)

I let the water cycle for the rest of the day and this evening I decided to use the master API kit to do an initial baseline test.

These are the results(If I performed the tests correctly)

I did the low PH test and it was top of the scale so I did the high PH test and it was 7.8 - 8.0

Ammonia test 1.0 PPM (not sure that is normal, since I have not added anything to the system)

Nitrite 0 PPM

Nitrate 5 ppm

My water company lists chloramines as 1.4ppm to 4.5ppm

[David Hart]

I'd read about sodium ascorbate on another AP site, when I setting up my backyard system a few years ago.  I ordered mine online....in a bulk bottle. Just pure sodium ascorbate. Doesn't cost too much and lasts a long time.
A few of us tried it in different areas of the country...we filled up a 55 gallon barrel and did the testing. It seemed to work.

It 'may' effect the water's ph ect ....but it takes so little, one wouldn't think it would be much of an effect. I do remember some posts that vitamin C in the acid form would effect it more.

As far as the effects on plants....None that I've noticed, mine have done very well.

Mark, if I remember (working on my morning coffee here) when the chloramines are 'broken down'...it releases ammonia into the water.

[Mark]

Well that should give me a start for when the grow media arrives.

Thank you again for your help.

David Hart said:

I'd read about sodium ascorbate on another AP site, when I setting up my backyard system a few years ago.  I ordered mine online....in a bulk bottle. Just pure sodium ascorbate. Doesn't cost too much and lasts a long time.
A few of us tried it in different areas of the country...we filled up a 55 gallon barrel and did the testing. It seemed to work.

It 'may' effect the water's ph ect ....but it takes so little, one wouldn't think it would be much of an effect. I do remember some posts that vitamin C in the acid form would effect it more.

As far as the effects on plants....None that I've noticed, mine have done very well.

Mark, if I remember (working on my morning coffee here) when the chloramines are 'broken down'...it releases ammonia into the water.

[TCLynx]

Yes, when you break up the bond between the chlorine and ammonia in the chlroamine, you wind up with some free ammonia, wich will give you something to start your fishless cycling with so not a bad thing.

[Mark]

I have a couple of other questions.
Since I only have a 40 gallon tub for a fish tank, then I should only have 2 goldfish?
At least that is what I understand from reading through the forums, I guess 2 fish will provide enough nutrients for the 25 gallon grow bed, does this sound correct?
Running the system in the basement and it looks like the water temp is going to stay right at 60 degrees.
Is 60 going to be good or do I need to heat the water?


I guess I should start some plants growing so when the system cycles they will be ready to put in the grow bed
What is the best type of plant to start with that will give me the best chance for success until the system has time to get established?
I think I remember someone mention beans?

Got a T5 light installed on Monday along with a timer, should get the grow media on Wednesday

I am a little nervous about all this, trying to make my first attempt a successful one :)

[RupertofOZ]

Always stock to the filtration capacity of your grow bed(s).... not to your fish tank size..

[TCLynx]

So if you will have a 25 gallon grow bed, I would say you should only stock about 3 fish that might grow to plate size (one fish per cubic foot is about 1 fish per 7.5 gallons of grow bed).  However goldfish are not likely to grow that big fast so you may have some leeway.

However I would recommend you start out by fishless cycling since you are nervous about it since fishless cycling is generally less stressful for you and the fish.  Remember this is supposed to be fun and the worst thing that will happen is a bit of water on the floor or some dead fish or plants.  Make sure that a water spill won't be a major disaster and then everything else you can deal with

[Mark]

Yes I plan on doing the fishless cycle, bought some janitorial ammonia at Ace hardware.

Once I get the grow media and clean it, I will let the ammonia that is already in the water cycle for a day or so and take some readings with the API kit to see where I am at before adding any ammonia.

Thank you for the information on calculating the fish quantity to the grow bed and not the tank size, this will be helpful, I hope to add a bigger system once I get my feet wet with this one.
I would like a big enough system to have a few bluegill or catfish.

I haven't added an overflow pipe, I probably should, the grow bed sits over the fish tank but some water would hit the floor if it overflows.

[TCLynx]

If you are doing a timed flood and drain the top of the stand pipe usually makes a fairly good overflow but having a backup overflow might still be a good idea.

If you have a siphon, definitely add an overflow just to be safe.  Make sure to plumb it through the tank lower than you think you should, you can always add an elbow and some pipe to adjust the height higher if you need, i you put the hole just under the rim, it might not save you in time.

[Mark]

The pump will be running 24/7 and I have a bell siphon so I guess this would be considered a flood and drain system just not on a timer.
I am not running it at the moment since the grow media has not arrived yet, but I guess I should ask if I should be running it already even though my grow media is not in it yet, is there any benefit to running it yet?

[TCLynx]

Call it testing.  And if you had chlorine, it would be outgassing.  Chloriamine takes weeks to go away though so you don't get to claim that excuse.

So if you have been running it already.  Mark your high water level.  You will want to make sure your media will come up an inch or two above that high water level.  Place your overflow so that if the water comes up over that high water mark for any reason, it will go down the overflow.  It is kinda handy that you can see this without the media since if you had media in already it would be much harder to drill the hole and install the overflow and set it for the correct height.  Make the overflow at least twice the size of the pump inflow.  So I'm gonna guess if you have a pump inflow of 1/2" then your overflow should be 1" pipe.

[Mark]

Good ideas, I went back and looked things over.
I need to reduce the stand pipe height a little and decrease the height of the 3 inch strainer pipe and increase the bell pipe length so I can get to it once the media is in place.
I also need to get the overflow installed.
So I just thought I was all ready to go. :)