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Comment by Vlad Jovanovic on February 8, 2013 at 10:48am

They do a much better job of utilizing what little sunlight there is, because I spent the previous couple weeks building up there leaf mass/surface area...and they are not piddly scrawny seedling, but robust leafy seedlings...more leaf mass, means more photosynthesis. They continue growing well, instead of languishing all puny and small forever...Yes, it uses some electricity sure, but it beats waiting 3 or 4 months for them to grow to sell-able size. The electricity more than pays for itself in the volume of produce within a (shorter) given time frame that I am able to sell the lettuce, bok choy, nappa cabbage etc.... I already can't keep up with demand. When its warmer out I'll be able to up those numbers but for now 328 every 10 days is about all I can do (or all I'm willing to this year) with what I have...

Comment by Vlad Jovanovic on February 8, 2013 at 10:47am

I don't heat any of my water. My daytime temps range from 3C to 18C...but mostly around 8-12

My pH started at 8.2, (since my kH was sky high) but is now slightly under 7 or slightly above 7 depending on the time of day (the ol' diurnal pH swing...very slight though...not much algae in the system)...

I've been torture testing my system...starving NH3/4 and bringing nitrates down to 0...then seeing how fast I can reach 50ppm NO3. Bio-filtration is working better than my wildest dreams at these crappy temps (the books and charts had me scared). I've quit doing this kind of testing last week because it's impacting production, and will keep NO3 in the 50-60ppm range...

People definitely need to adopt strategies that will work in their particular micro-climate, and will help them achieve their particular AP goals...whether that means a low input/low maintenance easy as pie Zen Garden type eco system, or a high density, highly productive system (which is then high maintenance and takes a lot of work and know how, to run) that cranks out X number of veggies at a predictable rate in a consistent manner. You really can't have it both ways...The marketing ploys (balanced low input eco system model) used to sell the romantic idea of AP, is obviously (or should be obvious at least) different from the realities of running a high density agricultural method of food production [model] (this is also used a part of the marketing...particularly the part about plant densities and grow out times...the two don't really quite go together...In the end...it's all just zero's and ones...input/output folks...there's is just no way to escape it...That said, I doubt 95% of folks doing AP even know what or in what numbers plant essential elements comprise their fish food, and how much of those elements their breed of fish recovers as bio-mass...how much is left for their plants...how much their particular cultivars need of what (and not only essential elements, but at what temp is a root fully functional...how much light does that plant need etc)...What is it that their bacteria need to function well (there's more to it than just pH NH3 and temps)...This type of stuff should be pre-requisite knowledge. It is at the core and is the basis of everything. It will explain why something is doing great, or not doing well...so that you can then go about rectifying the situation...Input/output...

I'm gonna go read that post now Bob...my wife is gonna kill me...

Comment by Rob Torcellini on February 8, 2013 at 9:03am

It's too bad that you've stopped AP, but I can understand the frustration with the misinformation that's out there.  It's one of my goals in my videos to make sure everyone understands what's involved with AP growing...the good and the bad.

(Trying not to insult anyone) I think one of the main problem is that many growers are in climates where it is easy to grow so they say, it's easy and quick.  The rest of us live in far harsher climates and have to twist mother nature's arm a bit more.  

When people come to me for AP advice (they usually want to start by installing a commercial operation), I tell them, to start small, learn what works in their micro-climate, and calculate all their operating expenses (and then double it! LOL).  Then I tell them to revisit a larger scale system after growing for at least 2 full seasons with their test system....they usually don't like that since they are too impatient!  

Comment by Bob Campbell on February 8, 2013 at 8:42am

@Vlad Jovanovic-  I feel that I was mislead by a lot of hype, and have turned my gardening focus back to good old soil based gardening.  I would like to hear your advice to Rob.  I just wrote a scathing post about the wild claims aquaponic sellers often quote.  But if we are doing something wrong I'd gladly retract my statements.

Comment by Rob Torcellini on February 6, 2013 at 1:05pm

Yeah, I know it's slow...but I was getting tired of people claiming 5 weeks so I threw this number out there to lower the bar a bit.   Nothing wrong with creating a bit of controversy once in a while!

I will admit that I put no effort into these.  I drop a couple of seeds into each pot and don't touch them.  If I get 2 plants per pot, I thin them out.  pH is right at 7.0, very low on NH3, NO2, and NO3.  Iron levels are good.  O2 levels are unknown, but the Koi seem to be happy.    Roots are nice and clean.

I'm trying 4 different varieties (I can't recall the names at the moment).  One which said it did well in the cold...I notice no different from the others!  What types are you growing?

What temp to you keep the water and the air during the day?

Once it warms up a bit and I get a bit more light, they will take right off!  During spring-fall, I have more than enough!

Comment by Vlad Jovanovic on February 6, 2013 at 12:38pm

Rob I gotta tell ya, that's really damn slow. Now, I fully agree that there are some un-realistic numbers being thrown about in AP-Land...But christ on a crutch that's slow! (I'm not trying to rub it in, I'm just surprised is all)...my water temps are almost half of what yours are...I do heat the GH at night but I only keep it in the +3 to +5C range...Daytime temps obviously vary...I'm working on my 3rd 'batch' of lettuce...Since November...the first of which sold out long ago, the second batch is almost all sold (by the end of tomorrow it'll be totally gone)...Yesterday, and the day before I planted out 16 more rafts (18 holes per raft) with seedlings that look about as big as many of yours do...only I planted the seeds a few weeks ago...I'm averaging about 10 weeks (give or take) with the lettuce (from seed to full grow out size not 'baby heads' or anything). And it gets damn cold and cloudy up in these hills in Serbia...

Taken the 8th of Nov. 

 Here's are the same plants 8 weeks later...pic taken Jan 7

 Now, I did not leave this kind of stuff entirely to chance...If you want you can PM me, where you can outline what/how/method you are sprouting and planting out...and I can tell you what my strategy for dealing with this type of issue has been. I'm sure a lot of it has to do with location and everything, but I think you could probably do better...At least I'd sure like you to be able to 

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