Produce Marketing

Great topic TCLynx.

When I go to my local farmers market in San Antonio and Austin and look at the lettuce the ( AP farmers) are selling, it is under size and many times wilted. I have been a consultant on Organic produce for 4 yrs for a large grocery chain. I can see how many of these grower fail, if it is too small or the variety is under preforming you can not expect big sales. Harvesting to soon will kill your current sales and your reputation.

Rick,

So what would you say is the best varieties to grow for the grocery market?  The reason I ask is that my produce is being sold to the only grocery store in town.

Rick,

   the topic you mention there is probably worth starting a Discussion on this group about.

Kim, Keep in mind that the best variety to grow is going to be the one that grows well for you in your climate/situation and provides the best margin and the least trouble for you.  It takes a lot of time during the start up/research phase of an operation to figure out what grows best, has the least problems AND can be grown profitably.  What sells best in one location is likely to be vastly different in another location.

Kim, you have an interesting situation there.  Do some market research while you are also doing variety trials.  Find out what the store wants to stock.  Find out what the customers want to buy.  And test seed varieties that will fill those needs and figure out the costs to see if you can price them appropriately to get you some profit while also being able to sell.

That is one of the hardest things for a small operation.  You have to charge enough to cover your costs and be able to make a living BUT if that means you have to charge 6 times more than the going price for the regular produce people can get, you probably won't be able to sell.  This is a big reason that I recommend people NOT go into debt to start up a farm or aquaponics operation.  If you are not only having to cover the operation costs but also pay on a loan especially through the first couple years of operation (when you are likely still figuring out what to grow and how much it costs and how much you can get) it is very likely that people in this situation go under.

From a commercial stand point, we have a major problem that never gets talked about and that is marketing!  I have teamed up with the "Suncoast Co-op". This group is affiliated with Habitat for Humanity. They take a 10% commission and sell only organic produce via a local market and a membership web site.  Merchandise for sale is posted by me on Sunday evening. Buyers post their orders by noon on Thursday.  I deliver the orders, and get paid, Saturday AM prior to 11:00 AM.  I take a few "extra" items for the "Market"  which sells direct to the public until 2:00 PM.  Those sales I collect the funds for the following week.  So part of this is building a customer base. 

Dave, do you have organic certification?

I sell produce through the Orlando Home Grown Co-op.  they don't allow any traditional chemical farmed products but they don't require organic certification though they do inspect farms before they allow new farms to join.

They do the online ordering have two weekly pickup days and also have a brick and mortar store that is open 7 days a week.  Unfortunately the co-op takes 36% to cover overhead and the store.  Theoretically you take an invoice in with each order and on Wed each week they are supposed to be cutting checks for the previous weeks sales.

Kim,

You want to grow varieties that are comparable in appearance  to what is being sold conventionally (Non-organic). Most customer are looking for a variety that is similar to what is on the shelf. Example if your grocery store does not sell an oak leaf green leaf lettuce on the conventional rack, do not grow some and expect people to grab it up. Now it is true that you will have some people looking for that variety but when you are looking for the masses( more money) you need to grow a variety that people are use to seeing. Also size is important, many organic growers will try to sell a smaller head of lettuce compared to what the conventional size is, but this can hurt your sales. First you are more expensive then conventional so you sell less and second the head is smaller so my perceived value is reduced by how little I'm getting for my money.

If your customer ( the shopper in the store not the grocery store) sees that your product is a little more money but looks the same, grown locally, fresher, and is organic it now has a better value to the shopper and can justified the higher price.

I'm sorry I did not ask if you were organic..... ( my rant above was assuming you were) if not, you should be. It will allow you to charge more.

Make sure that your bag or label clearly explains your key points.

Local, sustainable agricultural, smaller carbon foot print, etc...

Rick,

The discussion about Organic can be a complex one, it will depend on your market if it will be worth it.  In some places and if you are large enough to be selling wholesale to large grocery chains, then getting the Organic cert would be worth it.  If you are marketing and selling direct to customers through farmers markets, Local produce stands and direct farm sales and via subscription, it may be far more location dependent to figure out if the organic certification is going to earn you enough more on your produce to justify the added expense of getting certified and STAYING certified.

If you know your customers personally and they know what your farm is about, they are far less likely to want to pay extra for you to get certified (at least here the part of FL I'm in.)  Now I know farms in California that sell at markets where you better have that Organic certification because no one will even walk close to your booth unless they see the magic words in your sign.

Some of this is due to the fact that many really small local growers have little to no chance in affording the certification and the growth of the Local food movement.  And then there is the fact that many of the really big name agribusiness and food corporations have managed to get so much allowed into the "organic" regulations that more and more people are less and less impressed by that word in Marketing.

So, I would say Do careful research to help you decide what to grow and if it makes sense for you to go Organic.  There are only limited methods in aquaponics that will "easily" get you the organic certification.  So if you are not carefully following those methods and using all the right materials, you may have to go through a lot more time, hassle and expense to get your certification than if you are following one of the presidents exactly.

As far as I know, hybrid systems haven't gotten certified.

The Suncoast co-op, has many "home made " items such as candles, baked breads, yogurt and other "creative items".

I have had good success propagating fig , dragon fruit and other food plants from cuttings. All of which sell well and for a premium, but at or below local Lowes & Home Depot prices..

I have built 2 4x8 6 inch raised beds for root vegtables, that have not done well my aquaponics system.

As to organic certification.... forgive me but I want as little interaction with government as possible. 

I only brought up the Organic certification because you said they sold only Organic and legally you can't claim you are organic unless you have that government interaction and get the certification.

For most small farmers the cost of organic certification is a cost that is difficult to be justified. Many of us just see it as one more level of government  bureaucracy. In any small business, your name and reputation, has much greater value than some government stamp of approval.  More simply stated, would be "Organicly grown".  I am one of the few "aquaponic  growers".  Some do grow "hydroponicly" but most grow in dirt under "organic" conditions.

A bigger problem comes when you want to sell your fish (as food).  I would like to hear how others have handled that problem.  

Only way I have sold any fish has been whole or live.  Basically a neighbor comes over and wants some fish, we net them out into a cooler of ice and they take them home to clean them.

Or some one wants fingerlings and they come over with an aerator and cooler or bucket.

Only fish I have sold has been live fingerlings (about 3 to 4 months old) at 50 cents each. (Tilapia)

Selling fish, though can be profitable, in NY is a royal pain.  Can't sell live fish at the farmers market (their rules).  Can sell live fish with a permit (State Law).  Can sell headless fish at Farmers Market, but state law requires a processing permit to clean the fish unless body is intact and not gutted.  To get a NY processing permit  you need a USDA certification and have a " clean" facility.  You also need a disposal permit for the remains as well as a certified water capture unit to prevent dischage in to a public water system with out first filtering fish remains.  Wait did I say it was profitable or impossible?

The asian markets are about the only ones who want to buy live fish, because their mongers take care of it all based on what customers want.  Typically in my area they will pay $2.00 per lb. of Tilapia, $3.50 per lb. of Trout and up to $5/lb for Salmon.  Catfish/Bullhead they pay .75/lb.  Of course with that on the table now I would need to add live tanks to the truck so I can transport as well as a NYS Permit to transport live fish, in case I crash and dump the fish in to some waterway....so they tell me.

John, I know of some people who grow out fish for the live asian markets and the markets take care of coming and getting and transporting the live fish so it might be worth finding out if any of the asian markets in your area will come pick up the fish.

But I figure the fish are primarily for Us/friends/neighbors and I'm selling the veggies.

TCLynx: Thanks, I have talked with two so far that will pickup but only once a contract is signed.  I don't have the business setup yet so I can not set a promised qty for them.  One is looking for 100 Tilapia a month @ $2/lb with pickup.  But then there is all this if I don't meet the Qty, they can drop the contract.  As for vegetables they gave me a list of what they want and qty per month.  It has help with business planning but thus far $$, and the business plan are not up to snuff.  I am getting help from the USDA and Farm Bureau. So on that note the AP setup is heavily being redesigned to meet the business needs and also fit a niche of out of season items grown fresh.  As you know it is hard to compete with the big grocery stores that get a leaf lettuce bundle on shelves for $1.99, when I am selling it for $2.99 at the Farmers Market.  Even though AP was not originally for me to be a "farmer" with fish being the supplement item to sell.  I just wanted to produce my raw materials for my salsa and sauce business, to reduce those production cost.  I just keep getting sucked in further to other aspects.

I really would recommend that anyone wanting to do this check with getting a table at a Farmers Market.  Some will give you space for free or at a minimal charge.  Take your farm fresh  items you have grown and place them out and get to know the people at the market.  Find out what are they looking for.  See if you can fill that niche.

If all goes as you expect step it up a notch at the Farmers Market.  Fred, who is retired, sells at our farmers market.  Did not start urban farming till just before he retired.  He decided to try to sell his veg and spices at market.  He had a hell of a time.  But he realized after 3 months of sticking with it that he was selling out of Lavender, dill, cayenne, and other spices.  He pulled all his plants got a greenhouse and started planting only herbs.  After the first season he sold more dried herbs and spices than anyone and he only had to dry them, and bag them, with a nice label all at home and free of any licenses or state regulations because they are dried spices and herbs but still fresh, usually less than a week in the bags.  He now has 4 greenhouses on his city lot with his house and he is making more money than he does from his retirement a month, all year long in the North East.  Because he took the lumps and wasn't stubborn to give the shoppers what they want.

John - what kind of help are you getting from the USDA and Farm Bureau?   Thanks

My experience in raising the fish is  #1 keep the water moving!  My sump pumps run 24/7.  and #2  give the fish room!  When you put the fish in the tank  they are about 1 oz. fingerlings.  In 8 to 10 months they will have increased 16 times in size.  Mature fish will need 5 to 7 gallons of water per fish.  I had approx. 400 tilapia in 1,255 gallons over 5 tanks.  I now just added another tank of 275 gallons and have another 275 gallon tank to be added in 2 months,  but I'll  will have to pick up additional tankage before September or start harvesting fish for sale as food.

Nance Black Woods, The USDA has Farm Loan Programs that are run via individual states Farm Agencies.  In NY the FSA, Farm Service Agency, does it.  The assistance other than financial has been with business plan review, guiding new farmers, through the process of, starting a farm, financing and farm business management.  They have offered courses, sponsored by the USDA, Farm Bureau, or NYS FSA, on various agriculture business subjects as well as other topics such as "Farm to Market".  The state offers special legal services through lawyers that specialize in agriculture and small business.  The assistance has been wonderful as they review the business plans, offer suggestion for changes, do's and don'ts.  The USDA and NYS FSA have put us in touch with other farmers specializing in artisan type farms, which has helped with some partnerships, where one may offer something that the others don't have and we compliment each other and assist in growing and developing our crafts.

Thanks, John.  I'll see what Texas has available.

I'll make a recommendation here, start small!  If you have to go into debt to get going with an aquaponic operation, you may find it really tough going trying to make ends meet while also trying to make loan payments.  Farming is one of the worst businesses to have to go into debt to do since it tends to be so hard and unpredictable the income.  (this actually has very little to do with aquaponics, farming in general costs alot and doesn't make a return very fast.)

TCLynx is absolutely right.  And in all honesty AP does help you start small, good way to get a feel for what you can really grow and what quality you can grow, especially in your region, some plants that do well in soil have not translated well to AP and others that I have had terrible problems with are flourishing well, thanks to tips from TCLynx, Vlad and others here (for the life of me I can grow the largest tomato vines in AP but never get a tomato  ).  Keep good records, cost of seeds, water, tanks, pumps totes, feed.  Frequent the farmers markets see what they sell their products for.  Talk to the small farmers there, you will be surprised how many of them love to talk about the business and how they started and what they grow.

I will say that the farming part is not something I try to do for money but for the want and love of it.  I know my business is making habanero based foods, sauces, salsa, chutney and various other unique concoctions  like habanero wine and black pepper vodka, I only turn to AP as a means to make my own raw materials in a more cost effective manner.

Nance Black Woods, with the USDA I stated at the link below.  Read, research and ask questions.  As much as I despise much of the Government and all the entities, they are a wealth of knowledge as well as your states co-operative extension, and I know Texas has a wonderful COE program.  Just need to ask the questions.

USDA Link

OH yes, I'm starting small.   I'll be 62 this summer and am looking to get this started so I can supplement my diet and income - not get rich.  :D  Definitely not going to go into big debt to start anything.  My soil here isn't good so I haven't been able to grow much and this is definitely a viable option.    Gardening has always been a passion of mine but since moving here its been frustrating.  So glad I found this method and group!   Thanks to my friend in Clermont, FL I discovered that this was being done and am taking classes when I can find them.   Thanks everyone for the input!

I am located on the Gulf coat of FL, 30 miles north of Clearwater. I have wasted a great deal of time trying to grow tomatoes & peppers, with little to no success. I have great success growing lettuce. I would like to hear from other commercial growers, as to what produce items are making them money

Kale, collards and swiss chard have actually been some of my best selling crops.  Lettuce grows great but seems to take a lot more work for what it has brought me.

Thanks, kale, collards and swiss chard are not common to our household, so I have totally overlooked them.  Certainly worth a try.

I grow the Kale collards and chard in media beds and they are plant that though they take a fairly long time before I can start harvesting from them, once they are producing, I can continue harvesting leaves from them weekly for months. 

Celery is another one that could do continual harvest.

Lettuce is generally a one time harvest though some people will pick leaves off for salad mix which might give two harvests off the same plant.

Watercress is another good plant for aquaponics at least during cool weather.

Different herbs can be popular but which ones will depend on your market.

I am trying to grow 4 crop cycles per year. One problem has been items that take time but produce little. I currently have over 200 bush beans (green beans) that started to mature 3 weeks ago, but haven't produced a full pound of beans yet. I have cucumbers that started well then started to wilt. I discovered they were heavy feeders.  I have increase the grow area to about 1 sq.ft. per plant and they seem to be doing well.  But that meant moving a lot of other plants. 

I have done well propagating fig plants and dragon fruit plant, which sell very well via our local co-op. I just put in 16 new fig cuttings in the past week.  But to survive the cutting must be in the grow trouths within an hour or two of cutting them.

Yea, funny how aquaponics seems so easy when just doing it as a backyard hobby but as soon as you income is riding on it everything gets so much more complicated.

Two and a half years into this venture and I have grossed about $200 for this year.  I do have the good fortune to be a member of a grower's "co-op".  I list my produce with them on Sunday night. I get my orders for the week on Thursday at noon. And I deliver the products Saturday morning at "The Market".  The market takes 15% commission for this service. The market is affiliated with a local chapter of Habitat For Humanity and has a rather large "organic garden" on site.  All items sold are organicly grown.

As I am located in western central  FL, summer sun and heat are major obsticals to successful growing.