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Comment by Ezequiel on June 9, 2010 at 9:27pm

hi I just build my first system,so what do you all think?
working in a barrelponic flood & drain.Plus, it might be interesting to check out some of the designs people have come up with in fl and get some ideas, Thanks!!!!

Comment by TCLynx on April 29, 2010 at 8:33pm

I've found that with flood and drain media beds, the fish/plant balance doesn't have to be perfectly aligned all the time. A mature system can happily keep plants going for quite some time with minimal/no fish and if the system is low on plants for a time when new fish are added, so far in my experience, the nitrates have not caused problems with my fish. Granted, I'm not keeping breeding stock long term. The longest I've ever kept an individual fish was less than 2 and a half years.

I'm also minus greenhouse at this point. I had to remove it but I've found that even with a greenhouse, this past winter was too cold to keep tilapia alive without active heating. Catfish will survive quite well even with cold water so I may run this winter without a greenhouse at all. Luckily here in Central Florida, I probably don't need to worry about frozen aquaponic pipes but if we have another winter like the last one, I might need to be careful about saying that where "Murphy" can hear me.

There are plenty of cool weather crops that will happily survive a central Florida winter in an ap system.

Comment by Ron Thompson on April 29, 2010 at 7:45pm

As Michael mentioned, we are working together towards a common goal. Micael uses a more in-depth, researched approached while I rely on a combination of aquarium experience, common sense and the KISS principal.

The issue that has me the most concerned at present is fish vs plant balance -- my wal-mart pool is larger than my plants need. Michael's thoroughness is helping me overcome that issue. The second issue I will face in about six months is keeping everything warm through winter. A greenhouse is not in my budget.

As for an air pump, Michael and I have selected different ones to compare. He is using a Danner pump wihile I'm using a Commercial Air Pump. both are putting out 70 lpm and likely could be used for an airlift of 12-24 inches. Given a few months of use, I'm sure we'll know which is better in the long run

Comment by M Cosmo on April 18, 2010 at 7:18pm

Some Airlift links and related items. In no particular order
I haven't found the facts and figures for the lift - flow - size yet. But I have found many interesting sources for Airlift pump information. Here are a few of them.

Breakthrough Discovery of the Affect of Bubble Size on the Efficien...

Interesting self cleaning diffuser
Amazing Device Pumps Well Water Using Compressed Air (video)


Evaluation of air-lift pump capabilities for water delivery, aerati...
Demonstration of Airlift Pump and
Lignocellulosics in Recirculation...
Performance analysis of air-lift pump design
Performance of a small air-lift pump
RECIRCULATING
AQUACULTURE
SYSTEMS
MINIMUM STANDARDS
FOR DESIGN,
CON...
How to build a 750 GPH AIr LIft?

Airlift Pumps in Recirculating Systems1
Theory of Small-Diameter Airlift Pumps

Comment by David Hart on April 18, 2010 at 8:38am

As Joe Friday would say...."All we want are the facts, ma'am"

I was hoping , one of Michael's links might get into the efficiency facts and figures of air lifts versus pumps.
Plus, it might be interesting to check out some of the designs people have come up with.

Comment by TCLynx on April 18, 2010 at 7:09am

I know there has been much discussion and even experimentation by people over on BYAP to do with air lifts, geyser pumps, etc. I could see some applications being appropriate but they are generally where there is already going to be a fairly large air pump or blower anyway and the head heights are fairly low in relation to the depth of the water tank. If it is choosing between an air pump specifically to run an airlift pump or a regular water pump, chances are the regular water pump is going to be more efficient at moving water to a given height for the wattage used.

Basically, if you got a system with a huge amount of air pumping already on hand, it might not be such a big deal to add in the plumbing to have a air lift or geyser lift some water. Most big commercial operations already have large blowers running and in some cases lifting water just a little bit to send it to a settlement tank or a filter is reasonable. Expecting a small linear, piston, or diaphragm air pump to run the airlift or geyser pumps needed to lift water 5' above the surface of the fish tank might not be reasonable. Regular air lift pumps can't lift water higher above the surface than the depth of the airlift plumbing below the surface. So for a regular airlift pump to lift water 5' above the fish tank, the fish tank is going to need to be well over 5' deep. A geyser pump apparently is able to lift water to greater heads.

Something I've never quite been able to find though is, how much air is required to pump some specific amount of water under a set of conditions. Basically, I've never seen a pump efficiency curve for airlifts or geysers to give me any way to compare if it is more efficient to use a particular set up of airlift or geyser pump instead of a regular water pump. I'm not going to buy a pump if no one can tell me how much it can pump at a given set of conditions. Most good water pumps will tell you how many gallons per how or minute they will move at given head heights.

Comment by David Hart on April 18, 2010 at 6:21am

Hi Michael, That would be nice....having a few links on airlifts.
Thanks.

Comment by M Cosmo on April 10, 2010 at 6:20pm

Ron Thompson is working with me and he has. I have found everything on line from short lift to deep well air lift pumps. Some very interesting diffusers and some promising research on bubble size. I could post some links.

Comment by David Hart on April 10, 2010 at 2:58pm

Michael, have you used air lifts before and gotten 5 ft of lift ? Or, is this what your hoping for ?

Comment by M Cosmo on April 9, 2010 at 9:58pm

I am just building my first tanks for my Vertigro gardens this weekend. I am sure those who have been doing Aquaponics in Fl longer are more aware of what the issues are doing this in Florida. But I was doing this at New Alchemy in the 70's and build Dome homes and commercial structures and other Bioshelter and Alternative technology since then.
So here I am having just built a greenhouse and now integrating aquaponics and other permacultre that I have learned and am learning.
So here are the issues that I am dealing with this week and some of the possible solutions I am using or thinking of using. These are not just Florida issues but many have Florida specific situations.
1. Cooling, ventilation and shading the greenhouse.
(Aluminet shading - Solar openers of the roof ridge - Solar chimney convection cooling)
2. Heating the GH, Fish tanks and plants.
(My bioshelter experience suggests passive storage in with the fish tanks to temper the GH.
3. AC vs DC as the primary and backup systems. Monitoring.
(Power outages and Hurricanes may mean a DC Marine industry system with AC keeping it charged. Off the grid when needed - Solar wind are always in the back of my mind)
4. Tilapia - Hybrids - Permits - Breeding
(Some folks are doing some interesting breeding - I need to learn more.)
5. IPM - Aphids - Grasshoppers - Polination -
( HELP)
6. Humidity - Misting
(Constant flow in the towers - Foliar feeding - Night time moisture)
7. The plant to fish ratio and adding organic nutrients to balance.
( "Total" from Greenworld Path - Worm Castings (got my Worm Factory two days ago)
8. Using Airlift pumps to raise the water 5 ft for the vertical towers.
(Multiple vs single pumps - Air vs water.
9. Off course the whole Veritcal vs Float vs NFT vs Flood & Drain.
( Vertical Gardening is us Awesome for many reasons. My experience so far)
That is enough pontificating for now.

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