understanding the economics - Aquaponic Gardening2024-03-29T11:39:34Zhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A330619&feed=yes&xn_auth=noBummer. I just love the idea…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-16:4778851:Comment:3361962012-05-16T18:29:51.311ZLance Rosehttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/LanceRose
<p>Bummer. I just love the idea of putting the BBQ next to the tank and pulling my prawns straight from the tank to the grill. <img src="http://www.bkserv.net/images/Grin.gif"></img></p>
<p><br></br> <cite>Chris said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A336285&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment336285"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Thanks for the link. The main problem with them is that they are territorial and stocking density is…</p>
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<p>Bummer. I just love the idea of putting the BBQ next to the tank and pulling my prawns straight from the tank to the grill. <img src="http://www.bkserv.net/images/Grin.gif"/></p>
<p><br/> <cite>Chris said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A336285&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment336285"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Thanks for the link. The main problem with them is that they are territorial and stocking density is generally the issue. You almost certainty need troughs like in a raft system to make it feasible. Not something I want to try at first but its worth looking into how I could implement it at a later time.</p>
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<p>I have also seen on youtube, a prawn farm in New Zealand that was raising them in pens to achieve pretty high density for their tanks. It wasnt aquaponics but the concept still applies.<br/> <br/> <cite>Lance Rose said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A336306&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment336306"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Very cool. Wonder if you could use the huge prawns they have as the "fish" in an aquaponic system?</p>
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<p>Cool, Google says you can!</p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://friendlyaquaponics.com/docs/HowManyPrawnsCanISqueezeIn.pdf">http://friendlyaquaponics.com/docs/HowManyPrawnsCanISqueezeIn.pdf</a></p>
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</blockquote> Thanks for the link. The main…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-16:4778851:Comment:3362852012-05-16T14:52:48.182ZChris Carrhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/Chris954
<p>Thanks for the link. The main problem with them is that they are territorial and stocking density is generally the issue. You almost certainty need troughs like in a raft system to make it feasible. Not something I want to try at first but its worth looking into how I could implement it at a later time.</p>
<p></p>
<p>I have also seen on youtube, a prawn farm in New Zealand that was raising them in pens to achieve pretty high density for their tanks. It wasnt aquaponics but the concept…</p>
<p>Thanks for the link. The main problem with them is that they are territorial and stocking density is generally the issue. You almost certainty need troughs like in a raft system to make it feasible. Not something I want to try at first but its worth looking into how I could implement it at a later time.</p>
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<p>I have also seen on youtube, a prawn farm in New Zealand that was raising them in pens to achieve pretty high density for their tanks. It wasnt aquaponics but the concept still applies.<br/> <br/> <cite>Lance Rose said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A336306&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment336306"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Very cool. Wonder if you could use the huge prawns they have as the "fish" in an aquaponic system?</p>
<p></p>
<p>Cool, Google says you can!</p>
<p><a rel="nofollow" href="http://friendlyaquaponics.com/docs/HowManyPrawnsCanISqueezeIn.pdf">http://friendlyaquaponics.com/docs/HowManyPrawnsCanISqueezeIn.pdf</a></p>
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</blockquote> Very cool. Wonder if you coul…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-16:4778851:Comment:3363062012-05-16T14:39:07.539ZLance Rosehttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/LanceRose
<p>Very cool. Wonder if you could use the huge prawns they have as the "fish" in an aquaponic system?</p>
<p></p>
<p>Cool, Google says you can!</p>
<p><a href="http://friendlyaquaponics.com/docs/HowManyPrawnsCanISqueezeIn.pdf">http://friendlyaquaponics.com/docs/HowManyPrawnsCanISqueezeIn.pdf</a></p>
<p></p>
<p>Very cool. Wonder if you could use the huge prawns they have as the "fish" in an aquaponic system?</p>
<p></p>
<p>Cool, Google says you can!</p>
<p><a href="http://friendlyaquaponics.com/docs/HowManyPrawnsCanISqueezeIn.pdf">http://friendlyaquaponics.com/docs/HowManyPrawnsCanISqueezeIn.pdf</a></p>
<p></p>
The wife is from there :) W…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-16:4778851:Comment:3359522012-05-16T02:45:29.399ZChris Carrhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/Chris954
<p> </p>
<p>The wife is from there :) We are going to test out living there for now and see how it works out. If it doesn't work long term, we will move back to Canada where I am from. (eastern Ontario)<br></br> <br></br> <cite>Lance Rose said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A335739&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment335739"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Just curious, as this is a little…</p>
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<p>The wife is from there :) We are going to test out living there for now and see how it works out. If it doesn't work long term, we will move back to Canada where I am from. (eastern Ontario)<br/> <br/> <cite>Lance Rose said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A335739&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment335739"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Just curious, as this is a little off topic....</p>
<p>What prompted you to decide on Vietnam? That's and interesting choice.</p>
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</blockquote> Just curious, as this is a li…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-15:4778851:Comment:3357392012-05-15T13:13:31.736ZLance Rosehttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/LanceRose
<p>Just curious, as this is a little off topic....</p>
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<p>What prompted you to decide on Vietnam? That's and interesting choice.</p>
<p><br></br> <br></br> <cite>Chris said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A335579&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment335579"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p><br></br> Not positive what exactly we will be using for materials and just thinking of options now.…</p>
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<p>Just curious, as this is a little off topic....</p>
<p></p>
<p>What prompted you to decide on Vietnam? That's and interesting choice.</p>
<p><br/> <br/> <cite>Chris said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A335579&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment335579"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p><br/> Not positive what exactly we will be using for materials and just thinking of options now. There are several food processing plants in the area, as well as a small brewery and a small local sodapop factory. Havent contacted them yet to see if we can get totes yet or not. We are not moving until Janurary so a relativly long time for now, but I am still counting the days.</p>
<p><br/> <cite>Lance Rose said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?xg_source=msg_com_forum&id=4778851%3ATopic%3A329575&page=5#4778851Comment335155"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Thanks for the detail. Where do you plan to get the IBC's? Can you ballpark how much will the whole thing cost you? I like sketchup because I have changed my mind a dozen times on every part. </p>
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</blockquote> Not positive what exactly we…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-15:4778851:Comment:3355792012-05-15T03:42:20.712ZChris Carrhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/Chris954
<p><br></br> Not positive what exactly we will be using for materials and just thinking of options now. There are several food processing plants in the area, as well as a small brewery and a small local sodapop factory. Havent contacted them yet to see if we can get totes yet or not. We are not moving until Janurary so a relativly long time for now, but I am still counting the days.</p>
<p><br></br> <cite>Lance Rose said:…</cite></p>
<p><br/> Not positive what exactly we will be using for materials and just thinking of options now. There are several food processing plants in the area, as well as a small brewery and a small local sodapop factory. Havent contacted them yet to see if we can get totes yet or not. We are not moving until Janurary so a relativly long time for now, but I am still counting the days.</p>
<p><br/> <cite>Lance Rose said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?xg_source=msg_com_forum&id=4778851%3ATopic%3A329575&page=5#4778851Comment335155"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Thanks for the detail. Where do you plan to get the IBC's? Can you ballpark how much will the whole thing cost you? I like sketchup because I have changed my mind a dozen times on every part. </p>
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</blockquote> Thanks for the detail. Where…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-14:4778851:Comment:3351552012-05-14T14:11:26.877ZLance Rosehttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/LanceRose
<p>Thanks for the detail. Where do you plan to get the IBC's? Can you ballpark how much will the whole thing cost you? I like sketchup because I have changed my mind a dozen times on every part. </p>
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<p>Thanks again.<br></br> <br></br> <cite>Chris said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?xg_source=msg_com_forum&id=4778851%3ATopic%3A329575&page=4#4778851Comment333757"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Thanks for…</p>
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<p>Thanks for the detail. Where do you plan to get the IBC's? Can you ballpark how much will the whole thing cost you? I like sketchup because I have changed my mind a dozen times on every part. </p>
<p></p>
<p>Thanks again.<br/> <br/> <cite>Chris said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?xg_source=msg_com_forum&id=4778851%3ATopic%3A329575&page=4#4778851Comment333757"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Thanks for sharing your plans Lance. I am currently planning to do almost the exact same thing next year after relocating to Vietnam and documenting the whole thing. I have put a lot of thought into design keeping cost and materials in mind but it is something I cant make decisions on until I am actually there.</p>
<p>To your point regarding 6mil plastic liner. It will work but you will just have to be careful not to puncture it and keep it out of the sun.</p>
<p>The setup you are planning is very similar to what I initially thought as well. I too wanted to place the tank underneath the grow beds but considering the materials used, general maintenance and for ease of access I think its a regrettable design. Ultimately I believe we are looking for something similar in volume and design to an IBC based CHOP2 system. If you do a quick search you will find many systems built using 3 IBC totes (1 full tote tank, a half sized tote sump, and 3 beds). If totes are available or affordable the might be best to use but keeping the basic plumbing diagram the same, moving the components around and changing the materials used should be just fine if needed.</p>
<p>Once I move my thoughts into a google sketuchup I will post them. The idea for my scenario anyway would be to build a system in a 4'x20' footprint which should be also easy to cover, maintain, and will conserve space. Once everything is up and running well it should be relatively simple to expand in a modular fashion. Each module also should be straight forward couple together or isolate each other for controlled experimentation purposes.</p>
<p>My personal goal is not to run as a profit business but a hobby experiment(s) and maybe get to reduce the food bill which will be one of my largest living expenses.</p>
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</blockquote> The other end of 6 mil plasti…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-14:4778851:Comment:3349662012-05-14T14:03:52.629ZLance Rosehttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/LanceRose
<p>The other end of 6 mil plastic is that I can get it free. And if it last two years, I will hopefully rebuild my system anyway at that point My concern is that it may have been exposed to sunlight. I will have to see how brittle it is. I can see how building a system, planting plants, getting it cycled up, adding fish, THEN finding a leak that requires a rebuild would put me in a bad mood.</p>
<p>The other end of 6 mil plastic is that I can get it free. And if it last two years, I will hopefully rebuild my system anyway at that point My concern is that it may have been exposed to sunlight. I will have to see how brittle it is. I can see how building a system, planting plants, getting it cycled up, adding fish, THEN finding a leak that requires a rebuild would put me in a bad mood.</p> I have looked at the IBC solu…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-14:4778851:Comment:3349652012-05-14T13:58:43.829ZLance Rosehttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/LanceRose
<p>I have looked at the IBC solution and I like it. But my wife has declared it "ugly". She will let me get away with a lot, but not if she considers it ugly. Ugly, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. I am also looking at covering it with cedar. I had a cedar tree hit by lightning last year in the back of my pasture. <br></br> <br></br> <cite>Chris said:…</cite></p>
<p>I have looked at the IBC solution and I like it. But my wife has declared it "ugly". She will let me get away with a lot, but not if she considers it ugly. Ugly, like beauty, is in the eye of the beholder. I am also looking at covering it with cedar. I had a cedar tree hit by lightning last year in the back of my pasture. <br/> <br/> <cite>Chris said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A334609&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment333757"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Thanks for sharing your plans Lance. I am currently planning to do almost the exact same thing next year after relocating to Vietnam and documenting the whole thing. I have put a lot of thought into design keeping cost and materials in mind but it is something I cant make decisions on until I am actually there.</p>
<p>To your point regarding 6mil plastic liner. It will work but you will just have to be careful not to puncture it and keep it out of the sun.</p>
<p>The setup you are planning is very similar to what I initially thought as well. I too wanted to place the tank underneath the grow beds but considering the materials used, general maintenance and for ease of access I think its a regrettable design. Ultimately I believe we are looking for something similar in volume and design to an IBC based CHOP2 system. If you do a quick search you will find many systems built using 3 IBC totes (1 full tote tank, a half sized tote sump, and 3 beds). If totes are available or affordable the might be best to use but keeping the basic plumbing diagram the same, moving the components around and changing the materials used should be just fine if needed.</p>
<p>Once I move my thoughts into a google sketuchup I will post them. The idea for my scenario anyway would be to build a system in a 4'x20' footprint which should be also easy to cover, maintain, and will conserve space. Once everything is up and running well it should be relatively simple to expand in a modular fashion. Each module also should be straight forward couple together or isolate each other for controlled experimentation purposes.</p>
<p>My personal goal is not to run as a profit business but a hobby experiment(s) and maybe get to reduce the food bill which will be one of my largest living expenses.</p>
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</blockquote> a 200 gallon system with 100…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-14:4778851:Comment:3350752012-05-14T13:57:50.238ZCliff Jaggerhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/CliffJagger
<p>a 200 gallon system with 100 fish pays itself back in just a few months. I said it before, dont over think Aquaponics. In time you will see the areas that you over spent on things you really did not have to buy. Its just like any new venture - "live and learn" (:<br></br> <br></br> <cite>Lance Rose said:…</cite></p>
<p>a 200 gallon system with 100 fish pays itself back in just a few months. I said it before, dont over think Aquaponics. In time you will see the areas that you over spent on things you really did not have to buy. Its just like any new venture - "live and learn" (:<br/> <br/> <cite>Lance Rose said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/understanding-the-economics?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A334963&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment334963"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>In the end, the "is it worth it" argument is a good one. It points out the different intangible reasons for doing AP. But I am more of a experimenter. I want to give it a try on a small (100 gallon) system. Obviously, it would be hard to feed me, much less my family, on this size system. But I hope to learn the ropes. Then use that hard earned experience to build a bigger system. The fun is in the journey!</p>
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<p>What I would like to see are the numbers from different setups across multiple climates. If we could get enough of those types of numbers in the public forum, people could try to match their needs to systems with realistic expectations. </p>
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<p>How much did items cost? where are the trade offs? What type of system should I build? When/If a certain style lose/gain the economies of scale? Until I see real numbers, answers to these design questions are just wild guesses. Due to system variation, even with good numbers, the answers will be vague, but a least I will have something to base the design. My experience is that more numbers are better. I can throw out the ones that don't apply to me. Living in Texas, heating cost for the water will be much less than living in Michigan. But cooler the water, that's an issue for Texas. Unless I am building it in my basement, then I have to look at a different set of numbers. The more numbers I see, the better I can adjust.</p>
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<p>In the end, if I spend $500 and can get something out of the system, it is a win. I will have learned a bunch and be ready to fix issues. The next system will be better. If I enjoy the process of building, then ANY output is gravy.</p>
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<p>I am already getting strawberries. My fish are getting bigger. I'm having fun. So, for me it is worth it.</p>
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<p>Do I want to go commercial? Will it become work at that point? Why would I ruin a perfectly good hobby? On the other hand, I heard a quote by someone famous "If you enjoy your job, you will never work a day in your life."</p>
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<p>Besides, if I didn't spend the money on this, I would spend it something else. Do I get strawberries from golf? </p>
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<p>Thanks for all the input on the 6 mil. I have been wrestling with that and put it in there to see if I could get advice. Thanks again.</p>
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