Does anyone know of specific plant(s) types that can be fed to tilapia & Koi? - Aquaponic Gardening2024-03-28T16:48:06Zhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/forum/topics/does-anyone-know-of-specific-plant-s-types-that-can-be-fed-to?x=1&id=4778851%3ATopic%3A199007&feed=yes&xn_auth=noCarey enough said. A theory i…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-09-05:4778851:Comment:2063212011-09-05T12:38:41.213ZDavid Waitehttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/DavidWaite
Carey enough said. A theory is all it is you said, got it. I am very pragmatic or practical so it was in my nature to bleed you for all the details. You are more theoretical in nature and was throwing an idea out there. Take care.
Carey enough said. A theory is all it is you said, got it. I am very pragmatic or practical so it was in my nature to bleed you for all the details. You are more theoretical in nature and was throwing an idea out there. Take care. Growzay one of the problems I…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-09-05:4778851:Comment:2063182011-09-05T12:29:36.215ZDavid Waitehttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/DavidWaite
<p>Growzay one of the problems I THEORIZE will happen if you go to all vegetable matter in your AP system is you will start seeing trace mineral issues in your plants. Fish meal has alot of trace minerals or a higher concentration of them than plant material. We can achieve the36 percent crude protien with fodder or wheat germ for weight gain in our fish but the trace element factor will have to be supplemented due to the fish cant eat enough minerals to transfer that to our plant to promote…</p>
<p>Growzay one of the problems I THEORIZE will happen if you go to all vegetable matter in your AP system is you will start seeing trace mineral issues in your plants. Fish meal has alot of trace minerals or a higher concentration of them than plant material. We can achieve the36 percent crude protien with fodder or wheat germ for weight gain in our fish but the trace element factor will have to be supplemented due to the fish cant eat enough minerals to transfer that to our plant to promote healthy plants. Can this be done with worms, grubs, and insects, I hope so. But a large scale operator just cant do this and make a profit yet. Will soldier fly do this maybe but again you have the trace element loss. I know freeze drying is way to expensive to have any impact to date. So in a nutshell if you use all plant matter your fish weight gain will be much slower that fish meal. If weight gain is not a concern then the plants will feed your fish but you will have to supplement externally with minerals to meet your plants needs.</p>
<p> </p> @ Growzay: Dude, apologies fo…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-09-05:4778851:Comment:2062132011-09-05T05:59:44.012ZCarey Mahttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/CareyMa
@ Growzay: Dude, apologies for messing up your thread. My point was that feed can be tailored to the specific needs of each type of fish we raise and that raw is better than heat treated, also that concentrated nutrients not only help our fish but our plants and therefore fruits have higher nutritional value. What comes out, must be first put in.<br />
@ David W: You just don't get it do you? I was simply illustrating an idea to spark interest and curiosity so that might self study. This was an…
@ Growzay: Dude, apologies for messing up your thread. My point was that feed can be tailored to the specific needs of each type of fish we raise and that raw is better than heat treated, also that concentrated nutrients not only help our fish but our plants and therefore fruits have higher nutritional value. What comes out, must be first put in.<br />
@ David W: You just don't get it do you? I was simply illustrating an idea to spark interest and curiosity so that might self study. This was an ordinary large capacity chest freezer used in restaurants, simply hooked up to the intake of a an old spray paint compressor, with a valve and disconnect on the outside. It was not a successful venture, therefore my current involvement with a local feed producer. Sorry to disappoint.<br />
@ Raychel: Your vigilance at record keeping would be an invaluable service to everyone in this field. Thank you! On a side note. I think it would be just fine to keep, and let them eat as much as they want throughout the day. As long as it is fresh and not decayed (too much). Most fish do naturally have biological clocks and thus feed when conditions are most likely ideal. However most fish are also opportunistic feeders and can adapt to new conditions. The more we can simulate these ideal conditions through controlled environments, the happier/ better production and reproduction becomes.I truly believe the swimming pond concept is the true future in sustainable food production.<br />
@ litano: you fed them oatmeal for ten years and they survived? The rest I agree. My Koi & Tilapia seem to…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-09-02:4778851:Comment:2045042011-09-02T22:17:33.162ZGrowzayhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/JGrowzayGerard
<p>My Koi & Tilapia seem to love eggplant leaves, arugula and oak leave lettuce - you're right, they do get used to a variety of food but start young (fingerling stage) and they need alittle time to get used to it</p>
<p>My Koi & Tilapia seem to love eggplant leaves, arugula and oak leave lettuce - you're right, they do get used to a variety of food but start young (fingerling stage) and they need alittle time to get used to it</p> I have been feeding koi and g…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-09-01:4778851:Comment:2026342011-09-01T14:16:00.287Zlitanohttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/litano
I have been feeding koi and goldfish one minute oatmeal for ten years only. The gold fish are like small kois. I just started feeding them peas and carrot blended in a food processor, plus the left over pulp from juicing vegetables, apples, etc. and they seems to love it.
I have been feeding koi and goldfish one minute oatmeal for ten years only. The gold fish are like small kois. I just started feeding them peas and carrot blended in a food processor, plus the left over pulp from juicing vegetables, apples, etc. and they seems to love it. I am going to take your advic…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-09-01:4778851:Comment:2026202011-09-01T07:25:49.648ZRaychel A Watkinshttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/RaychelAWatkins
<p>I am going to take your advice Carey. As a researcher know I should weigh the fish but it is too stressful on them. I once had a little screw die in my hands just because I picked him up, I used to do research on the parasites of small mammals. Stress is very easy to bring about and would throw your results off. I have to design an experiment to put equal amounts of fry of the same size in 3 tanks. 1. feed measured amounts or all they will eat of duckweed and azola, 2. feed them…</p>
<p>I am going to take your advice Carey. As a researcher know I should weigh the fish but it is too stressful on them. I once had a little screw die in my hands just because I picked him up, I used to do research on the parasites of small mammals. Stress is very easy to bring about and would throw your results off. I have to design an experiment to put equal amounts of fry of the same size in 3 tanks. 1. feed measured amounts or all they will eat of duckweed and azola, 2. feed them regular amount of commercial feed and all the duckweed and azola they want, 3. feed them just commercial freed. I will weigh them at 2 months and 4 months 6 months and 8 months providing I do not seem to stress them. Maybe weigh them at 8 months only. Compare females to females in each case and males to males. It has taken me about 8 months to get to 1 lb for the males on commercial feed. I will record what I observe every day. </p>
<p>Tonight I put 1 oz of duckweed in the fry netting. I bet by tomorrow it will be gone. I also put 3oz of duckweed, 3 oz of azola in one of my IBC tanks plus I fed them regular food. In less than 1/2 hour they had consumed it all.</p>
<p>I have been thinking about how fish feed and I don't think they eat 2 times a day in the wild. I believe they forage for their food. So I will leave the duckweed ion until they consume it I will note how long it takes them to eat it,</p>
<p>I will keep you all informed what happens.</p> Carey thanks for explaining h…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-09-01:4778851:Comment:2027082011-09-01T03:51:38.855ZDavid Waitehttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/DavidWaite
Carey thanks for explaining how you hooked a vaccum pump to the freezer without destroying it. And again thanks for explaning the difference between a subzero freezer and standart household freezer. Only about 2000.00 dollars. Again thank you for explaining how you went about getting the heat need to dry the veges. Oh ya take em out and shake them. I thought you were bullshiting me for a moment. My bust. tsk tsk.......................<br></br>
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<cite>Carey Ma said:…</cite>
Carey thanks for explaining how you hooked a vaccum pump to the freezer without destroying it. And again thanks for explaning the difference between a subzero freezer and standart household freezer. Only about 2000.00 dollars. Again thank you for explaining how you went about getting the heat need to dry the veges. Oh ya take em out and shake them. I thought you were bullshiting me for a moment. My bust. tsk tsk.......................<br/>
<br/>
<cite>Carey Ma said:</cite><br />
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/does-anyone-know-of-specific-plant-s-types-that-can-be-fed-to?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A202257&xg_source=msg_com_forum#4778851Comment202273"><div><p>@ Dave: First off; can you please just do what I do and direct your comment at me or whoever, instead of clicking that idiotic reply button. I think we can follow and would save some linier space for more replies. I wonder why this site doesn’t have threads?…Hmmm</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Anywayz, I appreciate your honesty and position. I always seem to be able to read out of context and apologize if I seem snooty at times. I am over worked and under paid yet I come here after a crappy day at work for relaxation?</p>
<p> </p>
<p>As a teacher, I never like to spoon-feed my students because they simply don't learn. In fact I like to poke them in different directions so they can investigate, understand then apply. When people ask me for specific plans or solve problems, I call them clients and expect to be paid for it. Sometimes, those that pay don’t like to show others what they have/ know/ paid for, (even if it seems like “no big deal” to others). That plus crippling losses of personal pics has very much rendered me proofless, but I will try my best within my abilities to give opinions to help. I hope that is enough and thank you for your respect and understanding. After all, you can’t expect a Lawyer to give out his “how to get out of Jail free” techniques for his upcoming trial.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>There are several ways to commercially freeze dry products and would behoove whoever wants to get serious into feed production to invest in a freeze-dry machine.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Now as for specifics and the process of a Gerry-rig thing, again it depends on what you have and how much you are willing to spend. But unless you are running a successful commercial operation, giving you specifics is just cute reading. I’ doubt you want to write as detailed a description of your AP system simply to back a comment (especially if you haven’t worked out the kinks).Again, sorry I don’t have pics of my old contraption and am working with a feed mill now so it doesn’t apply.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>I thought I was pretty clear about the basic concept. An ordinary freezer would work just fine. And yes, basically you are making a whole bunch of freezer burned stuff. It’ll probably only take a week to ten days, maybe more to dry it out completely without vacuum. There has to be air space between layers so that the ice can evaporate onto a condenser plate or the walls of the icebox (no you don’t want to run it through your vacuum pump, that’s what valves are for). Once the vacuum has been turned on to desired level or capacity, you close the valve. All ice is still in the freezer compartment. There is no need for super cold temps nor high vacuum as long as you have time.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>You want to spread it thin, as much surface area as possible so ice forms through the cell but outside of the cells. Slow cooling forms large crystals, while cooling it quickly forms smaller crystals. Cookie sheets work well too. Remove any ice formed. Those large crystals you knock-off by brushing, tumbling it through an old t-shirt or toss separated like chafe depending on size. After that, the rest can be tossed back in, to continue to dry until you have a dry mass that easily crumbles. Pulverize it quickly and return to the freezer. After it has refrozen and dried the final time pack it in a jar and vacuum seal it until ready to use. Store any leftovers in the freezer or reseal with vacuum. Space is never wasted because new batches are constantly being processed as the former batch takes up less and less room.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>@ Jon P: I think you get the jist of it, but it doesn’t have to that scientific when we are making small batches for testing. That graph only shows the optimum range but the process does slow down beyond those parameters but doesn’t stop. Yes it becomes very concentrated. Tough I haven’t tried it, I think you may be onto something there with the vac drying to produce airspace/ cavities; however that process might “boil out” or destroy the nutrients we are trying to preserve thus needing the cold temps? Keep reading and commenting. I hope we can learn together.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>@ David: I’m sorry to hear your freezer does not reach sub zero temperatures. Maybe you can convert it to a smoke box…hehe.</p>
<p> </p>
Cheers all.</div>
</blockquote> @ Dave: First off; can you pl…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-09-01:4778851:Comment:2022732011-09-01T02:56:06.256ZCarey Mahttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/CareyMa
<p>@ Dave: First off; can you please just do what I do and direct your comment at me or whoever, instead of clicking that idiotic reply button. I think we can follow and would save some linier space for more replies. I wonder why this site doesn’t have threads?…Hmmm</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Anywayz, I appreciate your honesty and position. I always seem to be able to read out of context and apologize if I seem snooty at times. I am over worked and under paid yet I come here after a crappy day at work…</p>
<p>@ Dave: First off; can you please just do what I do and direct your comment at me or whoever, instead of clicking that idiotic reply button. I think we can follow and would save some linier space for more replies. I wonder why this site doesn’t have threads?…Hmmm</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Anywayz, I appreciate your honesty and position. I always seem to be able to read out of context and apologize if I seem snooty at times. I am over worked and under paid yet I come here after a crappy day at work for relaxation?</p>
<p> </p>
<p>As a teacher, I never like to spoon-feed my students because they simply don't learn. In fact I like to poke them in different directions so they can investigate, understand then apply. When people ask me for specific plans or solve problems, I call them clients and expect to be paid for it. Sometimes, those that pay don’t like to show others what they have/ know/ paid for, (even if it seems like “no big deal” to others). That plus crippling losses of personal pics has very much rendered me proofless, but I will try my best within my abilities to give opinions to help. I hope that is enough and thank you for your respect and understanding. After all, you can’t expect a Lawyer to give out his “how to get out of Jail free” techniques for his upcoming trial.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>There are several ways to commercially freeze dry products and would behoove whoever wants to get serious into feed production to invest in a freeze-dry machine.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Now as for specifics and the process of a Gerry-rig thing, again it depends on what you have and how much you are willing to spend. But unless you are running a successful commercial operation, giving you specifics is just cute reading. I’ doubt you want to write as detailed a description of your AP system simply to back a comment (especially if you haven’t worked out the kinks).Again, sorry I don’t have pics of my old contraption and am working with a feed mill now so it doesn’t apply.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>I thought I was pretty clear about the basic concept. An ordinary freezer would work just fine. And yes, basically you are making a whole bunch of freezer burned stuff. It’ll probably only take a week to ten days, maybe more to dry it out completely without vacuum. There has to be air space between layers so that the ice can evaporate onto a condenser plate or the walls of the icebox (no you don’t want to run it through your vacuum pump, that’s what valves are for). Once the vacuum has been turned on to desired level or capacity, you close the valve. All ice is still in the freezer compartment. There is no need for super cold temps nor high vacuum as long as you have time.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>You want to spread it thin, as much surface area as possible so ice forms through the cell but outside of the cells. Slow cooling forms large crystals, while cooling it quickly forms smaller crystals. Cookie sheets work well too. Remove any ice formed. Those large crystals you knock-off by brushing, tumbling it through an old t-shirt or toss separated like chafe depending on size. After that, the rest can be tossed back in, to continue to dry until you have a dry mass that easily crumbles. Pulverize it quickly and return to the freezer. After it has refrozen and dried the final time pack it in a jar and vacuum seal it until ready to use. Store any leftovers in the freezer or reseal with vacuum. Space is never wasted because new batches are constantly being processed as the former batch takes up less and less room.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>@ Jon P: I think you get the jist of it, but it doesn’t have to that scientific when we are making small batches for testing. That graph only shows the optimum range but the process does slow down beyond those parameters but doesn’t stop. Yes it becomes very concentrated. Tough I haven’t tried it, I think you may be onto something there with the vac drying to produce airspace/ cavities; however that process might “boil out” or destroy the nutrients we are trying to preserve thus needing the cold temps? Keep reading and commenting. I hope we can learn together.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>@ David: I’m sorry to hear your freezer does not reach sub zero temperatures. Maybe you can convert it to a smoke box…hehe.</p>
<p> </p>
Cheers all. Try this for a rundown.
http…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-09-01:4778851:Comment:2022572011-09-01T00:57:36.395ZJon Parrhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/JonParr
Try this for a rundown. <br />
<a href="http://science.howstuffworks.com/innovation/edible-innovations/freeze-drying2.htm" target="_blank">http://science.howstuffworks.com/innovation/edible-innovations/freeze-drying2.htm</a><br />
Our freezers our sub-zero Celsius, of course, and cold enough for freeze drying to occur, but it is very slow. If you follow that link, and look at the chart, sublimation occurs where the red zone touches the green zone. Basically below freezing and less than half an atmosphere.…
Try this for a rundown. <br />
<a href="http://science.howstuffworks.com/innovation/edible-innovations/freeze-drying2.htm" target="_blank">http://science.howstuffworks.com/innovation/edible-innovations/freeze-drying2.htm</a><br />
Our freezers our sub-zero Celsius, of course, and cold enough for freeze drying to occur, but it is very slow. If you follow that link, and look at the chart, sublimation occurs where the red zone touches the green zone. Basically below freezing and less than half an atmosphere. The colder and the more vacuum, the better. My point earlier was that freeze drying is a method of DRYING for long term storage at room temperature. If it's not totally dry, it won't keep. So a half-assed attempt is no good, unless you store it in the freezer, an then it doesn't need to be freeze dried, does it? I suspect vacuum drying will be cheaper, easier, effective as a preservative, less wasted energy, and the added bonus of fluffing the feed to make it float. Freeze drying would make the feed float too Just throwing out brainstormi…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2011-08-31:4778851:Comment:2025292011-08-31T23:29:52.914ZTCLynxhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/TCLynx
<p>Just throwing out brainstorming ideas on the topic until Carey can get back to us with more details.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Uh, I think our freezer is sub 0. Now I have to go check on that.</p>
<p>Just throwing out brainstorming ideas on the topic until Carey can get back to us with more details.</p>
<p> </p>
<p>Uh, I think our freezer is sub 0. Now I have to go check on that.</p>