Do I have this about right? - Aquaponic Gardening2024-03-29T11:16:14Zhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/forum/topics/do-i-have-this-about-right?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A342565&feed=yes&xn_auth=noYes it is!tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3442122012-05-31T21:53:48.784ZPhil Bowyerhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/PhilBowyer
<p>Yes it is!</p>
<p>Yes it is!</p> It's a pretty good feeling hu…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3441132012-05-31T21:44:02.440ZVlad Jovanovichttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/VladJovanovic
<p>It's a pretty good feeling huh? <img src="http://www.bkserv.net/images/Smile.gif"></img> <br></br> <br></br> <cite>Phil Bowyer said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/do-i-have-this-about-right?page=4&commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A344207&x=1#4778851Comment344207"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>A bit of a side note, that probably isn't that exciting to you veterans, but I just got back from watering my seedlings and I have hot peppers (jalapeno & hot wax), red bunching onions and relleno…</p>
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<p>It's a pretty good feeling huh? <img src="http://www.bkserv.net/images/Smile.gif"/><br/> <br/> <cite>Phil Bowyer said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/do-i-have-this-about-right?page=4&commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A344207&x=1#4778851Comment344207"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>A bit of a side note, that probably isn't that exciting to you veterans, but I just got back from watering my seedlings and I have hot peppers (jalapeno & hot wax), red bunching onions and relleno peppers starting to pop up. I planted them 10 days ago. </p>
<p>The tomato plants I started a month ago are looking really good too (almost ready to transfer to the beds I don't have built yet). </p>
<p>I've only ever gotten lettuce to grow from seed before, so I'm pretty excited.</p>
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</blockquote> A bit of a side note, that pr…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3442072012-05-31T21:27:38.599ZPhil Bowyerhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/PhilBowyer
<p>A bit of a side note, that probably isn't that exciting to you veterans, but I just got back from watering my seedlings and I have hot peppers (jalapeno & hot wax), red bunching onions and relleno peppers starting to pop up. I planted them 10 days ago. </p>
<p>The tomato plants I started a month ago are looking really good too (almost ready to transfer to the beds I don't have built yet). </p>
<p>I've only ever gotten lettuce to grow from seed before, so I'm pretty excited.</p>
<p>A bit of a side note, that probably isn't that exciting to you veterans, but I just got back from watering my seedlings and I have hot peppers (jalapeno & hot wax), red bunching onions and relleno peppers starting to pop up. I planted them 10 days ago. </p>
<p>The tomato plants I started a month ago are looking really good too (almost ready to transfer to the beds I don't have built yet). </p>
<p>I've only ever gotten lettuce to grow from seed before, so I'm pretty excited.</p> Vlad, we've got about 3' area…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3442062012-05-31T21:22:37.079ZPhil Bowyerhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/PhilBowyer
<p>Vlad, we've got about 3' area around each system, plus an empty (as of now) 48sqft area to just sit and enjoy. The greenhouse will be on the other side of the property so the fish will be in the greenhouse. I do think the greenhouse is a wise move. We wanted to all along but thought it was too expensive. My wife ran across a site that had plans for a hoop style, and we modified that and it's going to cost a 1/4 of what we thought (and ends up being cheaper than all the lights we would have…</p>
<p>Vlad, we've got about 3' area around each system, plus an empty (as of now) 48sqft area to just sit and enjoy. The greenhouse will be on the other side of the property so the fish will be in the greenhouse. I do think the greenhouse is a wise move. We wanted to all along but thought it was too expensive. My wife ran across a site that had plans for a hoop style, and we modified that and it's going to cost a 1/4 of what we thought (and ends up being cheaper than all the lights we would have needed). Better all around.</p>
<p>I do have some concerns about the winter, but I've got some things up my sleeve to combat that. </p>
<p>I did finish reading all 40 pages of that BYAP thread. Wow, it's like an AP textbook. It makes me not really want to do a siphon. I do like their site, been a member for a month or so now, but not really active. More of a lurker. </p>
<p>The whole permi thing is a tall order, but I think it all starts with a certain way of thinking. You don't have to be there from the beginning (if that's even possible). I'm going to do what I can, and keep growing it, and not stress about it.</p>
<p>I plan on documenting everything, so hopefully - even tho I'm a newbie - I can start to give back to the AP community and share what I learn.</p> Unless you've been designing…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3442032012-05-31T20:59:05.250ZVlad Jovanovichttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/VladJovanovic
<p>Unless you've been designing AP systems for the last 30 years, it's probably important that your design changes(hell even then to an extent)...The greenhouse is definitely a good move...hehe, just don't forget that you need some space in there to put your drink down...to move around and work...Are you able to keep the fish in the garage and the plants in the GH by any chance?</p>
<p>Phil when you're done reading through the trials, pilfer around the rest of the BYAP site...use the 'search'…</p>
<p>Unless you've been designing AP systems for the last 30 years, it's probably important that your design changes(hell even then to an extent)...The greenhouse is definitely a good move...hehe, just don't forget that you need some space in there to put your drink down...to move around and work...Are you able to keep the fish in the garage and the plants in the GH by any chance?</p>
<p>Phil when you're done reading through the trials, pilfer around the rest of the BYAP site...use the 'search' function there. Might get some ideas and/or answers to some questions that may have been mulling around in your brain. BYAP is a <em>really </em>decent AP forum...And I'd highly recommend downloading their free PDF "The IBC's of Aquaponics"... it was cool to check out all the different systems different folks had built...</p>
<p>I remember someone in India researching (building?) a neolithic AP system...sounded cool, wonder what ever happened with that..? Hope you find some way to make AP 'sustainable' or permi...seems like a pretty tall order.</p> I kind of feel the same Jon,…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3439982012-05-31T19:19:28.838ZPhil Bowyerhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/PhilBowyer
<p>I kind of feel the same Jon, . I've been designing a system and not only has the design changed, but so has the location (basement to garage and now a greenhouse). </p>
<p>I'm now reading thru the BYAP trial and getting all sorts of ideas. </p>
<p>At some point, right or wrong, you just need to dive in.</p>
<p>I kind of feel the same Jon, . I've been designing a system and not only has the design changed, but so has the location (basement to garage and now a greenhouse). </p>
<p>I'm now reading thru the BYAP trial and getting all sorts of ideas. </p>
<p>At some point, right or wrong, you just need to dive in.</p> Hmm. I'd say jump in, Phil. I…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3440392012-05-31T18:52:29.597ZJon Parrhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/JonParr
Hmm. I'd say jump in, Phil. I have been designing a commercial system for a year, and it hasn't stayed the same for more than a week. I am always finding a way to build a better mouse trap, or at least convincing myself that it would be better than the last one I didn't build, which was better than the one before it, theoretically. And the funny thing is after over a year of tinkering with AP I find myself returning to the most simplistic styles as being the most appealing. I'd have to say that…
Hmm. I'd say jump in, Phil. I have been designing a commercial system for a year, and it hasn't stayed the same for more than a week. I am always finding a way to build a better mouse trap, or at least convincing myself that it would be better than the last one I didn't build, which was better than the one before it, theoretically. And the funny thing is after over a year of tinkering with AP I find myself returning to the most simplistic styles as being the most appealing. I'd have to say that my most successful system is a wading pool. Nothing else. I have a bunch of duckweed on top, a few bluegill and a couple hundred blackfish, which is a filter feeder. No pumps, no media, no feed, pretty much a pond. The water is dark, full of whatever blows in (mostly oak leaves). It's an ecosystem by itself, decaying leaves feeding DW, algae, and Rotifera, and fish eating those things. It really is something for nothing. It's successful in that I haven't put anything in, and I'll get fish out, and I don't have to worry that a pump will fail or a siphon will fail, or power crashes, or feed spoils, yada yada. Off topic, sorry, but the point is pick a style and run, then pick other styles and compare. I started off convinced that media F&D was supreme, and IF I were to ever try raft, it would be for novelty and variety. Now I am building a 5k sq ft raft commercial system, which may or may not have any media at all. And I'm raising carp, which is the last fish I figured for, and so on. I just want to thank you all…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3438762012-05-31T16:33:10.288ZPhil Bowyerhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/PhilBowyer
<p>I just want to thank you all again for all your help and suggestions. I know some of you think I'm nuts for jumping into the deep end like this (and I probably am) but I have the time, and I don't mind mistakes - it helps me learn. I know nothing is going to be perfect, and am treating this like a journey and am having fun with this. </p>
<p>I'm going to take it slow, but at the same time jump in and get my feet wet! </p>
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<p>I just want to thank you all again for all your help and suggestions. I know some of you think I'm nuts for jumping into the deep end like this (and I probably am) but I have the time, and I don't mind mistakes - it helps me learn. I know nothing is going to be perfect, and am treating this like a journey and am having fun with this. </p>
<p>I'm going to take it slow, but at the same time jump in and get my feet wet! </p>
<p></p> I would actually be tackling…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3440062012-05-31T16:28:14.778ZPhil Bowyerhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/PhilBowyer
<p>I would actually be tackling each system on it's own, or at least get one up and going then start a new one once I felt comfortable moving on. </p>
<p>The exception is that I have to do duckweed. There is no feed available that is organic (or one that isn't comprised of corn and soy which fish don't eat). I refuse to allow any GMO's into any system I build, I just don't support that. As Chris mentioned about inputs, that will a struggle initially and will be part of the journey. In addition…</p>
<p>I would actually be tackling each system on it's own, or at least get one up and going then start a new one once I felt comfortable moving on. </p>
<p>The exception is that I have to do duckweed. There is no feed available that is organic (or one that isn't comprised of corn and soy which fish don't eat). I refuse to allow any GMO's into any system I build, I just don't support that. As Chris mentioned about inputs, that will a struggle initially and will be part of the journey. In addition to the DW, I'll have bugs, worms and greens, ect. to feed the fish. </p>
<p>I like the idea of your Vermi-DW-AP system. </p>
<p><br/> <cite>TCLynx said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/do-i-have-this-about-right?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A343695#4778851Comment343962"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>I would recommend getting started with One system. At this point you are going to have to choose a favorite for now or do a small integrated or mixed system and get started cycling it up and learning. When I say small I'm still thinking like 300 gallons of fish tank as being something useful for growing edible fish and being stable and all that.</p>
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<p>Anyway, get started with one system of whatever design or integrated but do get started on one before you get too wound up in the complete design of all systems since you will learn things as you build and operate that first system through cycle up and these things my change how you will design the other stuff. And while I think it would be great to do the tests of multiple types of growing off one fish tank so you can get some more concrete comparisons for yourself without having to guess about what effect too many other variables have, you will still probably need at least two separate systems for some redundancy/quarantine purposes.<br/><br/></p>
<p>I would probably go for the first smaller system.</p>
<p>Then decide if I wanted to add the duckweed system or the bigger system next. I would probably do duckweed production in a separate system though there may be fish growing in it instead of pee ponics but trying to integrate duckweed production with veggie growing can be tricky.</p>
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<p>Duckweed does like some aeration, Not too much but it has never grown well for me in tanks without some aeration (either coming down from towers but not splashing really or some small air stones in the long trough.) It is currently growing well for me in a long trough with air stones towers and pond plants with only a couple hours of morning sun and the rest of the day pretty well shaded (I am in a hot climate.)</p>
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<p>Anyway, duckweed is not really good at removing nitrates. Duckweed likes ammonia. So if your water was going through a bio-filter before going to the duckweed, then that might explain why your duckweed didn't thrive. And if there were solids or leaves or gunk (dieing duckweed or algae) in the system or under the duckweed creating an anoxic area, your high nitrates could have been denitrifying or getting converted back into nitrites and if you don't have adequate degassing (extreme aeration some how) going on after such an environment (the degassing would be releasing the nitrite into the atmosphere as atmospheric nitrogen) you wind up with toxic levels of nitrite and suffering fish.</p>
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<p>I'm thinking an AP Duckweed vermiponics sort of hybred might be useful for growing duckweed since the duckweed wants the ammonia but you want to remove some of the solids before it goes to a relatively still duckweed pond or you would need some easy way to remove the solids that settle in the bottom of a duckweed trough and having worms right there for mineralization in some sort of filter is handy. (I have fish water falling through some filter media where worms have taken up residence very happily and I could send such minimally filtered water to a duckweed bed and probably have a good thing going. I'll probably try something like that soon too. If not with my fish systems, I'll do it with Ducks.</p>
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</blockquote> No, I would be having 3 tanks…tag:aquaponicgardening.ning.com,2012-05-31:4778851:Comment:3438732012-05-31T16:21:42.165ZPhil Bowyerhttps://aquaponicgardening.ning.com/profile/PhilBowyer
<p>No, I would be having 3 tanks - sorry about the confusion. </p>
<p><br></br> <br></br> <cite>Vlad Jovanovic said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/do-i-have-this-about-right?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A343695#4778851Comment343871"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Cool...we were just sayin'<img src="http://www.bkserv.net/images/Smile.gif"></img></p>
<p>Wait, are you saying that you'll have just one fish tank, and one sump? and not three separate fish tanks? If so, then that would really be one AP…</p>
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<p>No, I would be having 3 tanks - sorry about the confusion. </p>
<p><br/> <br/> <cite>Vlad Jovanovic said:</cite></p>
<blockquote cite="http://aquaponicscommunity.com/forum/topics/do-i-have-this-about-right?commentId=4778851%3AComment%3A343695#4778851Comment343871"><div><div class="xg_user_generated"><p>Cool...we were just sayin'<img src="http://www.bkserv.net/images/Smile.gif"/></p>
<p>Wait, are you saying that you'll have just one fish tank, and one sump? and not three separate fish tanks? If so, then that would really be one AP system...just with 3 hydroponic sub-systems of differing types. One DWC raft, one flood and drain media bed, one constant flood media bed...but still just <em>one</em> AP system...I'm just trying to get on the same page...earlier you used the term "independent systems", yet you wrote... "<em>t</em><span><em>he only real constant would be the fish tank</em>". I'm not trying to be a dick, or rib you about semantics...Just trying to make sure we're all talking 'apples and apples'... </span></p>
<p><span>For instance I have 8 media beds and 4 DWC rafts, one fish tank and one sump. I can run 4 beds flood/drain 4 beds constant flood (and still have the rafts)...and it's still only ONE AP system...</span></p>
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